Out-economied by a KTM 500 EXC

So the guy down the street buys a KTM 500 EXC as his first bike...  His wife and my wife get talking, and I'm told it sure would be great if I took him out a bunch of times with me.

So I did (rides around Hungry Horse and the North Fork are now posted up at DualSportsMap.com).  He's actually doing just fine.

What I can't HELP but notice is that every damned time we pop into town off the gravel to gas up (don't wait until you have to gas up at Polebridge - gas is $6.99/gal), he puts slightly less fuel in than I do!  A 500 versus a 250.  It's not that my mileage is horrible - I'm getting 69 MPG US.  But that engine twice the size of mine getting slightly better gas mileage kind of hurts a bit.  I suppose that the extra 100 lbs me and my bike weight compared to what he and that 500 wieght might make a difference, but that much?  I'm suffering mileage envy...

Haven't tried his bike out yet - I'll wait until he goes down the first time before I accept his offer.  Sure it will be nice, although I can't see much fun in that razor blade of a seat over anything more than an hour of riding.  More interested in a general comparison of his suspension to mine, especially after I just got my bike back with some custom front fork work, gold valves, shim stack, etc.

Have to see how much he spends on service and whatnot over the next year or so, I guess...

Jäger wrote:

..  His wife and my wife get talking, and I'm told it sure would be great if I took him out a bunch of times with me.

So your wife made a play date for you?

gatorfan wrote:

So your wife made a play date for you?

It was more a "We think you should take him out riding so he doesn't kill himself..." kind of thing. 

I dunno what they thought he was doing - riding to his hidey-hole where he'd slip into Hells Angel's colors and then go cruising downtown Whitefish on his Orange Crush looking for a brawl?

He's just fine, with or without me or anybody else along for the ride.  Taking it slow, lots of common sense, well aware that you can meet a moron in a big truck using up all the road on a gravel road on any corner.  Montana has a few of those... dying in a motor vehicle accident, with at least one person involved being drunk seems to be the most common cause of death down here.  Haven't even heard him give into the temptation of hammering on the throttle on some of the long straightaways... I sure as hell would.  But, I can't talk him into wearing gloves, proper dirt boots, and some other dirt essentials... he'll pay for that with skin, sooner or later.  Some light body armour over a cotton shirt, jeans, and ankle height street boots just ain't gonna cut it.

He'll figure that angle out eventually...  It will be interesting to spend a day riding his bike instead of mine; he told me I can take it out for a rip anytime, so I'll be doing that once he puts some scratches on it.

Polebridge in Glacier? I've been there .... one of the most memorable days of my life. My buddies and I still talk about it.

gatorfan wrote:

Polebridge in Glacier? I've been there .... one of the most memorable days of my life. My buddies and I still talk about it.

Polebridge, just outside of Glacier.  You can come a bit further south from there down the North Fork and then cut over into Glacier; one route that ends at Bowman Lake, a second that cuts over to connect with Apgar.  He was tired by then, just wanted to return home.  Florida guy, not yet toughened up to living in Montana, I guess...  Or maybe that razorblade seat on his KTM wasn't fun anymore...

This ride here:



Drop around someday with a few days on your hands and we'll show you all the rides, especially all the ones that are much better than this.

Jäger wrote:

Florida guy, not yet toughened up to living in Montana, I guess... 

Well, this Florida guy carried 50 lbs. backpacking thru glacier national park on no less than 4 separate occasions. Most recently being the Two Medicine Lake area last fall for 5 nights. A griz walked right past our tent one night.

Thanks for the offer of local guidance - I may just take you up on it. I'm about ready to chuck work, buy an RV and live the dream.

gatorfan wrote:

Well, this Florida guy carried 50 lbs. backpacking thru glacier national park on no less than 4 separate occasions.

Cool... that just about qualifies him to carry my camera gear.  But... it's a start.

gatorfan wrote:

Thanks for the offer of local guidance - I may just take you up on it. I'm about ready to chuck work, buy an RV and live the dream.

Do take me up on it - my wife has a knee injury that may require knee replacement this summer.  So I have nobody to pack my extra camera gear...

I am travelling alone most of this summer and fall, so if you end up here there's lots of territory to cover.

Although, the way the rain keeps on falling, maybe we should just work on building an ark.

Sounds like the guy on the 500 didn't need to open his throttle very much most of the day.
Also, if his bike is still the way they are when imported into this country (EPA regs in place), I can see it being lean on fuel.
 
Any big single I've had will use fuel once they're derestricted and you start using the loud handle.

Jäger wrote:

Taking it slow, lots of common sense, well aware that you can meet a moron in a big truck using up all the road on a gravel road on any corner. ... Haven't even heard him give into the temptation of hammering on the throttle on some of the long straightaways... I sure as hell would. 

There's your answer...

The beauty of a big engine is that you don't have to push it hard to go fast. I came from a SV650 twin, and get about the same gas mileage, only slightly better on the WRx, 55-58 mpg compared to 50-55 mpg. The SV is barely humming along at 60, while the WR is working pretty hard to hold that.

Top Gear did a test like this. They take a Toyota Prius and a BMW M3 around the track at the same pace and find the M3 gets better fuel economy than the Prius! http://www.streetfire.net/video/top-gear-season-11-episode-1-full-version_part-1_706657.htm (Starts around 6:30)

That KTM 500 is a real beauty, I would love to bomb around on one for a while. Make sure you trade bikes for a day.

YZEtc wrote:

Sounds like the guy on the 500 didn't need to open his throttle very much most of the day.
Also, if his bike is still the way they are when imported into this country (EPA regs in place), I can see it being lean on fuel.
 
Any big single I've had will use fuel once they're derestricted and you start using the loud handle.

Yeah, I get that... but I didn't need to open my throttle very much either.  These are forestry roads, where the average speed is maybe 30 mph, no corner to corner racing, just idling along admiring the eye candy.  It's not like a WRR struggles with that.

If he did start riding it WFO on these roads, corner to corner, I would expect his economy to drop.  As would mine if I tried (and failed) to keep up with his bike.  But I didn't expect his economy (meaning: range) to be even better than mine as we just idled around on smooth forestry roads.  I arrived back in Hungry Horse sucking up tank fumes; he was probably good for another 30 or so miles.

maybe its just me but I find the economy really good on my wr but I do mainly road work on it, we have no mountains where I live here in the uk so no brokeback action for me, here we mainly meet at local public toilets for cubicle fun .

Jager

You need to quit inviting everyone and their WR up here to ride.  I enjoy the solitude of Montana forest service roads and your encouragement is going to ruin it for me. 

I looked at your riding map and I didn't see you stop at any fire lookouts.  They always have a great view! 

I live down in the Bitterroot Valley and ride a lot in Idaho.

MTWIBadger wrote:

Jager

You need to quit inviting everyone and their WR up here to ride.  I enjoy the solitude of Montana forest service roads and your encouragement is going to ruin it for me.

Trust me... it would be difficult for anybody to increase the amount of traffic going up the North Fork to Polebridge... 

Quote :

I looked at your riding map and I didn't see you stop at any fire lookouts.  They always have a great view!

Yeah... I'd rather ride alongside the lakes and deploy a fly line, than ride up to an outlook to view them from a distance.  For example...

















Most of the fire lookouts are also up on treed features.  I'd rather get up in the passes and rocks where you don't need no stinkin' lookout to take in the eye candy... but that's enough pics for now.

Quote :

I live down in the Bitterroot Valley and ride a lot in Idaho.

Where abouts, exactly?  I have a lot of interest in that area, ranging from backpacking in the Selway, to walk 'n wade flyfishing to (of course) dual sporting.  And sometimes, combining the two.  The one lake pictured above produced some outstanding dryfly fishing for Grayling, wading in no deeper than my knees.

The floods up in southeastern BC will probably throw a serious monkey wrench into dual sporting (and flyfishing) this year, so I am probably going to try and check out more of the area down your way.  Probably start with Missoula this summer because it's close to here in Whitefish and the flyfishing in the nearby areas is well known, but I'd like to expand the horizons a lot further than that.

You're killing me with those pics. Jager, I planned on hiking Rockwall trail in Kootenay Natn'l this September, you think the flooding will effect that??

Bigger CC bikes often get the advantage of being able to idle around :( our WRs lug WAAAAYYYY too soon IMO. In the woods on my KX, I wouldnt be surprised if the entire RPM range I use is below the idle speed of my WR. Course it still gets bad fuel mileage being a two stroke, but it gets vastly better than it does being kept revved up. Not an option on the WR.

Jager,

Looks like your license plate is upside down.

Jager
Nice pictures. My pictures never turn out that well.

I live in Corvallis and spend a lot of time in Idaho but don't fish. I've been to over 120 fire lookouts so I know the middle part of Idaho better than anyone. I was just in Elk City yesterday but came from Lowel. I've been on Magruder 10 times and rode the Lolo trail. I hike to lookouts I can't reach by my WR250R. In two weeks I'm headed to Hells Canyon for four days of riding. Last year rode to Yellow Pine and Cinabar ghost town. I've even been down to Mackay Bar on the main Salmon. I'm spending 5 days on Diablo Lookout in the Selway in Sept. Look me up if you ever get down here.

At least Polebridge has gas, good food/bakery, my wife and I go up there over the pass to have dinner and a ride....
Generally we ride around the Blacktail area, lots of sneaky single track.....Rico

gatorfan wrote:

You're killing me with those pics. Jager, I planned on hiking Rockwall trail in Kootenay Natn'l  this September, you think the flooding will effect that??

I was a seasonal warden in KNP in the early 70's and I don't even recall a Rockwall Trail.  Maybe Alzheimer's setting in?  Anyways, with the name "Rockwall", I gather it's in the Floe Lake, Tumbling Glacier, Wolverine pass area?

The brunt of the monsoon fell about 60 miles south of that area of KNP, so I don't think KNP would have gotten hit too hard.

If this is a trail recognized by KNP, calling the park will give you pretty good information on trail conditions and most specifically the sketchier parts of any trail like creek crossings, scree slopes, etc.  If it's a popular route, any damage done by the rain storm will have repairs well under way by the trail crews right now.

You're no doubt aware of this, but that area of KNP in September gets hit with snowstorms fairly regularly.  You can go from mid  summer conditions to December in just a few hours.  I'd be more vigilant about the long range weather forecast with a backup route/plan than damage from the rain.  Your intended hike is only about an hour from the Bugaboos...

oic0 wrote:

Bigger CC bikes often get the advantage of being able to idle around :( our WRs lug WAAAAYYYY too soon IMO. In the woods on my KX, I wouldnt be surprised if the entire RPM range I use is below the idle speed of my WR. Course it still gets bad fuel mileage being a two stroke, but it gets vastly better than it does being kept revved up. Not an option on the WR.

It's an option if you aren't riding WFO all the time.  Ambling around on forestry roads, checking out the mountains and the view, I have no problem finding a gear to travel in that doesn't have the WRR revved up or anywhere near that.  I imagine my average speed on dirt roads, depending on the view available at the moment, runs somewhere between 25 and 40mph.

Of course, when the WRR is idling around, the KTM is REALLY idling around... but it still has twice the displacement burning gas.

sswrx wrote:

Jager,

Looks like your license plate is upside down.

You are in fact correct.

That's what happens after four years of riding, when the licence plate metal around the mounting holes fatigues and breaks away.  I took it back  to the motor vehicle branch for replacement; when they told me how much they were going to charge me to replace the plate that the crappy metal had failed on, I said "screw that" and just mounted it upside down.

The law just says the plate must be mounted in a horizontal position and the lettering/numbers unobstructed and clearly visible... it doesn't say anything about whether the lettering is right side up or upside down...

MTWIBadger wrote:

Jager
Nice pictures.  My pictures never turn out that well.

I live in Corvallis and spend a lot of time in Idaho but don't fish. I've been to over 120 fire lookouts so I know the middle part of Idaho better than anyone.

I hit the occasional lookout - Mount Marston, Werner Peak (you can rent that one for the night!) - but unless there's a view of rocky mountains, glaciers, etc I'm not all that taken with vista views.  Not enough to go specifically there, anyways.  If they're en route... why not.

That particular area of Idaho interests me.  I don't see enough free time anytime this year, but it's an area on my mind and I wonder what the views are like - mostly high treed peaks, or lots of rockies interspaced with lakes, creeks and rivers.  View some of my ride reports and you'll see what I think of as my natural environment.

And I like fly fishing, possibly even more than riding my bike.  When you can put the two together, it's magical:
The Annual Streams, Lakes & Mountains Rockies Ride -2010
The 2010 Last Blast Kootenay Rock & Water Ride

Quote :

I was just in Elk City yesterday but came from Lowel.  I've been on Magruder 10 times and rode the Lolo trail.

I have a ride planned through there, fired up my GIS software and have the paper maps and GPS maps/tracks all set up and ready to go... but again, a time thief seems to be picking my pockets the last two years.  Day rides have been about the best I've been able to manage the last two years.  Always on my mind...

Quote :

I hike to lookouts I can't reach by my WR250R.  In two weeks I'm headed to Hells Canyon  for four days of riding.  Last year rode to Yellow Pine and Cinabar ghost town.  I've even been down to Mackay Bar on the main Salmon. I'm spending 5 days on Diablo Lookout in the Selway in Sept.  Look me up if you ever get down here.

I'll definitely keep that in mind.  Ditto if you're ever up in the Whitefish area, whether for a day or two of riding or just other stuff.  Chances are I will be away as I seem to spend most of my life these days living out of a duffle bag.  But you never know...