Start without power in the battery

Hi again gents
imagine: i haven't enough power in the battery to start the bike,but enough for get the green light on the dasboard
I m wondering if i can start with pushing the bike ?

Why not try it and report your findings?

I've accidentally left my key on for hours and the bike seemed completely dead, no lights what so ever. I successfully push started the bike, but the bike would not stay running at idle. I push started the bike again and kept the revs up to keep the bike running, rode the bike for one hour to get home. The battery had a decent charge by the time I got home, and since I ride the bike just about everyday, after another ride the bike was back to full charge and never had a problem at all, nor did I even have to hook the battery up to a charger.

yes,if everything else is ok. i have done this.

sturgeon wrote:

Why not try it and report your findings?

i wuill not put my battery in default just for test if some goods people have already get this bad situation and can share this experience....

FG250WRR wrote:

sturgeon wrote:

Why not try it and report your findings?

i wuill not put my battery in default just for test

Curious.

What exactly is your concern? What do you mean by " putting your battery in default"?

How can an attempt at a bump start be of such concern?

It won't damage your battery to push start it. It will simply have the tiny amount of power it needs to get the bike going and then charge up like it would on any normal charger.
This bike has quite a powerful charging system.

I do wish that there was a "ding" sound when you accidentally leave the key on without the motor running...

Ive run my battery down to empty about 3 times now lol... oops. Leaving the key in of course. Dead as a doornail.

I couldn't get it to push start.
I also couldn't get it to start by jumping it directly on the starter, making the motor spin with it all turned on. That sort of simulates a perfect push start, I wanted to do it that way to spare the electrical system and battery from having full car battery voltage put through it. No dice though.
I had to hook the cables to the battery, let it do its prime the fuel pump thing, and then I could start it but it would die if allowed to idle.

Once running though the battery recharged very quickly and has shown no ill effects from the being drained down like the batteries in my cars usually do. Once, within 15 minutes I stalled the thing in the woods, and it cranked back up full force like a champ.

I'm always worried that someday I'll be in the middle of nowhere and forget to turn the key off, and not even a good hill to roll down. I wonder if there's a way to put a buzzer in there somehwhere that goes off whenever thekey is on but the motor is off...

GusinCA wrote:

I'm always worried that someday I'll be in the middle of nowhere and forget to turn the key off, and not even a good hill to roll down. I wonder if there's a way to put a buzzer in there somehwhere that goes off whenever thekey is on but the motor is off...

Even better would be something that turns the light off after 5 minutes :(

I want a buzzer, because if the light just goes out, the other systems still drain power...

Is it safe to jump it using a car/truck?

From what I unserstand it is, but NOT with it running.

Jet Skis are the same way, quads too. If you can use another small system with the engine on, great, but if a full size vehicle/battery is all you have, use it but don't have the full size car/truck running.

GusinCA wrote:

From what I unserstand it is, but NOT with it running.

Good to know, thanks. I actually have a dead battery right now (at least I am pretty sure that is the problem). If I lived on a hill I would confirm the bump start question. I did see a thread on thumpertalk that seemed to indicate it was possible to push start the wr/x but its not easy... it helps to have a big hill.

That's due to the fuel injection/pump, I think. You have to push it hard enough to get the stator to provide enough power to the fuel pump to charge the injection system, and THEN the starting process can actually begin...

A big fat guy with a looong hill works best.

Like I said, running out of juice is an achilles heel of this bike...

Well my battery died this weekend on the trail (again I think its the battery given all the symptoms). I stopped to clean my goggles, went to re-start and nothing (no its not the kickstand/neutral thing unless its a bad sensor). Luckily it was a very small area and I was only about .25 miles from an access road so instead of trying to bump start it I just decided load up and call it a day. Also, lucky I had brought my truck, usually I ride to this area, but I was doing a "shake down" run of my new tire/tubliss system and new sprocket and chain so I had hauled it up. But it really got me to thinking... what if I was 10 miles back in the woods...

Its a 2010 that I bought in July of this year so I figure the battery is 2+ years old. I ordered a new battery. Even if it turns out to be something else I won't feel like I wasted money... I think I might find myself regularly replacing good batteries as part of preventive maintenance. I rather spend $60-$100 every two or so years to replace a good battery than be stranded on a trail some place. Hell, if I would have had to push it further than a quarter mile this weekend or repeatedly push it up a hill to try and start it I probably would have paid someone $100 to start it.

Every two years I replace my batteries on my bike, my quad, my boat, my cars...

And for that time when something breaks when you're 20 miles from anyone and without any cell coverage and it's about to freeze you to death, I carry this:

http://www.rei.com/product/791972/mcmurdo-fast-find-210-personal-locator-beacon-with-gps

I just never want to be on that show "I Shouldn't Be Alive"...

GusinCA wrote:

I want a buzzer, because if the light just goes out, the other systems still drain power...

Get a teather like you would use to kill the motor if you fell off. Put one end on the key the other on you,your gonna make it about 2ft. Turn around and remove the key.

That's an idea, actually...

http://jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=KC5317&form=CAT2&SUBCATID=965#11

i'm sure one of the american electronics/electrical engineering places would have something the same. just feed ign switched power to the headlight on circuit and it'll do the job.

dtx wrote:

Get a teather like you would use to kill the motor if you fell off. Put one end on the key the other on you,your gonna make it about 2ft. Turn around and remove the key.

You might want to consider including a breakable link in there that you'd feel let go. If the pull on the key were anywheres near 90 degrees to the key slot, I wouldn't want to bet the key would pull out instead of shear off. The rare earth magnet sets used to hang flyfishing nets off your fishing vest would probably work fine and you can definitely feel a real tug when they pull apart.

GusinCA wrote:

And for that time when something breaks when you're 20 miles from anyone and without any cell coverage and it's about to freeze you to death, I carry this:

http://www.rei.com/product/791972/mcmurdo-fast-find-210-personal-locator-beacon-with-gps

I just never want to be on that show "I Shouldn't Be Alive"...

Well, if you really are in imminent danger of freezing to death, I guess SAR won't mind coming to get you because your battery is dead. On the other hand, if it's just because you don't want sore feet from a long walk and maybe an uncomfortable night, then they could be a bit annoyed. And maybe hand you a bill, although most SAR operates on the theory that they'd rather not have people deciding not to contact them and then dying because they were worried about a bill.

I have and use a SPOT 2. I've read a lot of complaints about them. A lot of that seems to be from people who don't understand what RTFI means. And a lot about their business and billing model, which I readily agree is a bit whacked - I understand why they do it that way for liability reasons, but I think they could do it in a more user friendly manner although that would also be more complicated. But some people clearly have had problems with SPOTS, particularly the original. Of course, there are also reported failures with PLB's, including the McMurdo. The prevalence of problems is about the same as the WR fuel pump issue - you hear it mentioned constantly, but the vast majority are just chugging along with no problems whatsoever.

I have logged about 4000 miles this year with my SPOT transmitting, tracking on. A day's ride in the mountains around here usually about 250, 300 miles. I don't use it on the highway as I assume somebody will stop if they see a guy in a blindingly yellow jacket laying on the road after hitting a deer or whatever, so all those miles are bush miles. We have lots of crown closure on the roads around here, lots of deep mountain drainages, and lots of those drainages running E-W which is worst geographically for GPS. And, this far north, all the satellites are to the south. And the vast majority of time I use it with rechargeables in it, unless the going is in any way gnarly or conditions concern me in any way. I've been doing this deliberately to see if I can make it unreliable under safe circumstances using non-lithium batteries. I've been running it well into the blinking red warning lights to see when messaging failed.

So far, with a tracking message being sent every 10 minutes (4000 miles, average speed about 30 mph, a message every ten minutes... do the math), numerous "I'm Okay" and "Custom" and test "Need Assistance" messages sent, I have found exactly ONE missing tracking update. And one instance when I ran it for hours with the red warning lights blinking, and it finally did lose connectivity - and shut itself off at the same time. I finally managed once to run the rechargeable Ni-Cads (which they don't want you to use) flat.

Anyways, I'm always keeping an eye on it just like any other safety gear, but I like it and my wife is much happier knowing she can tell help where to go pick up my body if necessary. The messaging functions allow you to have a list of contacts that you can notify of a dead battery, mechanical/minor medical problem to come collect you in a truck or another bike if necessary. The 911 button will bring no-fooling-around SAR. And, if you crash badly enough you can't push the 911 button on a PLB or a SPOT, your tracking messages coming from the same location for hours after you're overdue should tell any of your contacts with a single brain cell that you are probably laying at or near that location.

But, probably a discussion topic for another thread.

Jäger wrote:

I have and use a SPOT 2. [...]

So far, with a tracking message being sent every 10 minutes (4000 miles, average speed about 30 mph, a message every ten minutes... do the math), numerous "I'm Okay" and "Custom" and test "Need Assistance" messages sent, I have found exactly ONE missing tracking update.

My experience almost exactly, and mine's first-generation. The only times I've ever seen missed updates are when portaging my canoe through dense bush. That means the SPOT is in the top of my pack, probably oriented incorrectly, probably slipped under a knife or something else in there, and under the canoe as well. Never had an OK go missing. That's about 3 years of fairly heavy use, both in the backcountry, even in the high Arctic, and on a bike. On the bikes, it lives inside a tank bag all the time, never an issue. It's at the top, pretty much face-up, but never a problem.

Yeah, off topic, but I use a Delorme PN-60w with Spot and use tracking as well. That way, if I do go off somehow unable to activate my PLB or SPOT, my wife knows how to look me up at findmespot.com and see where I was going...
I ride by myself, in the middle of nowhere. It's 2011, there should be no reason to die because you can't call for help...

GusinCA wrote:

I want a buzzer, because if the light just goes out, the other systems still drain power...

Here's an idea for a loss of oil pressure buzzer using an oil pressure switch from a car and a cheap 12v buzzer from Radio Shack.

The oil pressure switch would need to be from a car with an idiot light, not the gauge type. It would also need to fit in place of the oil pressure check bolt that you are supposed to check when changing the oil.

Radio Shack has a cheap 12v buzzer for about $4.

The buzzer would need to be wired so it has power when the key is on, the terminal on the oil pressure switch connects to the chassis ground when there is no oil pressure, which means the buzzer would be on whenever the key is on and the motor is not running or doesn't have oil pressure.