suspension setup help

inspector wrote:

I went and measured the sag. Wasn't quite 3inches. Are you trying to tell me this bike is better for a heavier person like me? Wow, that would be a first.

Could be. They don't seem to make things for lanky folks like me anymore. I can never find properly fitting clothes, It would only make sense that motorcycles won't fit right either.

I think the stock spring rate on the rear was selected more based on the combined weight of a rider + passenger or rider + luggage rather than just a solo rider in aggressive terrain.

I wish I could read Japanese. With a smaller average sized rider there, and at least an extra year with the bike I'm sure those guys have the secret sauce worked out for a variety of rider sizes and styles.

inspector wrote:

I went and measured the sag. Wasn't quite 3inches. Are you trying to tell me this bike is better for a heavier person like me? Wow, that would be a first.

And Pneukid, try being 6'7" and built correctly. Despite being proportioned correctly, not being fat or skinny and athletic, and yet I had to have the suite for my pending wedding custom made. Infuriating.

I'm going to try to set rider sag this week and see what's the what.

As another question, the front end should have the same 25-30%? Ironically, mine doesn't sag much at all in the front end as much as the rear, but I won't be able to test until I have a helper.

Pneukid wrote:

Shewolf

I've got the service manual, I can't find my owners manual.

Owner manuals are free, it's the service manual they want you to pay for. You can view the owners manual online at the Yamaha web site. Click on owners manual on the left and plug in your model. It appears they only have the '09 manual for our bike available, but it's damn near the same thing...

http://www.yamaha-motor.com/sport/service/servicehome/home.aspx

[quote="longtallsally"]

inspector wrote:

...
As another question, the front end should have the same 25-30%? Ironically, mine doesn't sag much at all in the front end as much as the rear, but I won't be able to test until I have a helper.

Curious; Do you have the R or the X? I too find that my X does not sag much. (185lbs, no gear)

mwakey wrote:

Pneukid wrote:

Shewolf

I've got the service manual, I can't find my owners manual.

Owner manuals are free, it's the service manual they want you to pay for. You can view the owners manual online at the Yamaha web site...

It seems that many manufacturers are making the owners manual available as a free download these days. It's really handy for when you buy a used bike and the manual has been lost.

25 to 30% is a correct number, we have 10.5 inches of travel so 3.5 inches of sag is "our" target.

[quote="ZED"]

longtallsally wrote:

inspector wrote:

...
As another question, the front end should have the same 25-30%? Ironically, mine doesn't sag much at all in the front end as much as the rear, but I won't be able to test until I have a helper.

Curious; Do you have the R or the X? I too find that my X does not sag much. (185lbs, no gear)

I have the R.

ZED wrote:

It seems that many manufacturers are making the owners manual available as a free download these days. It's really handy for when you buy a used bike and the manual has been lost.

Link to owners manual download from UK site.

http://www.yamaha-motor.co.uk/community/service/manuals.jsp

ZED wrote:

As another question, the front end should have the same 25-30%? Ironically, mine doesn't sag much at all in the front end as much as the rear, but I won't be able to test until I have a helper.

Curious; Do you have the R or the X? I too find that my X does not sag much. (185lbs, no gear)[/quote]

If that question is for me, I have the R. I know the suspension is broken in, not as stiff as it was when I first got it. It just does'nt seem right that at 215+gear I'm not getting that much sag. Maybe the previous owner was heavier or didn't know what he was doing as there are a lot of threads showing on the rear?

I was referring to the front. The rear sag on my X is OK, but under damped. The front sag is just about non-existant. I've had the forks out and back in. Nothing changed. I'm going to get some Ohlins 5W oil because I want to change it. We'll see if that has any effect.

Oops...I hadn't looked at this thread in a while. Let me try to respond to all, if I can remember them.

1) As far as "clicks" go, the manual doesn't match my bike on the front for top or bottom (I forget which). Just screw your adjusters all the way in, and the count them as you go all the way out. Then write that down. Doesn't really matter what the manual says. Just count your "clicks"....that's what you've got.

Now that my suspension is substantially broke in (ok beyond), I have firmed it up just slightly. Tightened rear spring preload about 2 turns (I can see 4 threads now) and I have 3.5" of rider sag. Changed the front to 12 clicks instead of 15. Think I left the others where they were.

2) As far as the Big & Tall size.....yeah, I'd think the springs might be a little soft for you muscular gents. Really, it depends upon how you plan to ride it. Are you going to hammer it in the rough dirt? Or just putt around town on the streets & dirt roads? In the rough, riding hard, you probably want a stiffer spring. Around town, its probably just fine for you. There actually is quite an adjustment range as the clickers produce pretty significant changes quickly.....unlike other bikes I've had where I could go from min to max and hardly notice a difference.

If I were a heavy laden rider, I would probably set my Sag on this bike closer to 2" for starters (maybe 2.5"). Whatever you do, just make one change at a time and ride. Otherwise, you'll never figure out what's going on (incrementally)...which is crucial to getting it right.

One more thing I do which may be unique (I donno), and it comes from my Trials background where suspension setup is sooooo critical. After the suspension is broken in well, I perform the following fine tuning procedure. I push down on the bike at a "center" point. Meaning a spot approximately halfway between pegs & bars (as if I was standing on the bike while riding) Usually, that is a position between the seat and the gas cap. So, I push down (on the tank area) in this center spot....up & down....slow & fast.

I'm looking to see how my suspension works front to back. I want MY suspension to work together in concert.....both ends flowing up & down together in unison when pushing down on a center point. I don't want the bike rocking back & forth.....which creates a bucking effect. Example, I don't want the front so stiff, that the rear collapses and the front barely moves. Nor do I want the opposite where the rear stays put and the front nose dives. I tweak my suspension until I find balance between both. Right now, I can walk up to R², grab the tank with both hands (halfway between seat and gas cap) and push the bike up & down in a fairly level plane. Now....that's what I like! And it translates into some nice characteristics out in the rough (for me).



HF

So I'm going to be doing alot of two up riding this summer. My girlfriend and I want to ride the bike to our local hiking trails. Our combined weight is 315 pounds. What would you all suggest I set the sag to?

jpkrass wrote:

So I'm going to be doing alot of two up riding this summer. My girlfriend and I want to ride the bike to our local hiking trails. Our combined weight is 315 pounds. What would you all suggest I set the sag to?

I hope it's not a long ride and there are no freeways involved. With that much on it, I'd expect a really cool little bike to quickly become not much more than a scooter when 2 up.

The bottom line is that the same principles apply- even though the weight is a little further back. So to do it correctly, you will need to follow the rider sag procedures, just with both of you on it. As such, I'd say it will be darn near all the way up as I am 2/3 of the way into the preload at 230 lbs by myself.

Just a tip on setting rear sag
Sit on the bike (in the right spot, with your gear)
have someone push the rear down compressing the shock
Let it settle up and measure
Have your partner lift the rear UP
let it settle down and measure again
There will be 2 different measurement's, split the difference for your final measurement

Worn parts or sticky pivot point's, even cold temp's can make for what feel's like damping problem's

Pete in Atlanta- I don't think anybody else mentioned this but you stated in the first post that "He said he lowered the rear by changing the position of the shock and lifted the forks up as far as they would go in the triples."

The second poster said you should lower the forks back down in the triples, but I think you may also want to check you rear shock block. I have a feeling the PO lowered the bike using the method in this link Lowered WR250R. If he did your bike is going to have a bit of a nose up profile if you have already raised the triple back to it's original position.

I apologize if someone already mentioned this

Well I just spent hours pouring through different suspension threads. Spent a full 10min. actually doing the work. Pretty much stuck with the second post in this thread from HF. The only thing that was not very close to those settings was the RS comp. damping setting. Everything else was within 2clicks.

Thanks HF and Krabill for all the info and kick in the pants to learn more. And bump to a good thread.

*Hey the riding is AWESOME out here in the PNW, who want's to move out here and teach me how to fine tune and actually ride?

Ok question: How do you get those threads to move to adjust the pre-load?? I tried tapping them around the threads with a flathead but they don't seem to want to budge.

Jus42 wrote:

Ok question: How do you get those threads to move to adjust the pre-load?? I tried tapping them around the threads with a flathead but they don't seem to want to budge.

you can see 2 lock nuts on the shock threads. Loosen (unscrew) the top one by whacking it with a punch or screwdriver. You'll have to hit it with a hammer. It will budge, just make sure you are turning it the right way. Unscrew it a little ways, then begin turning the other nut. If you put the bike on a stand it helps some, but you'll still have to whack it with a hammer & screwdriver. Tighten to increase preload, loosen to lessen. This is the 'race sag' adjustment.

good luck.

scotty

Jus42 wrote:

Ok question: How do you get those threads to move to adjust the pre-load?? I tried tapping them around the threads with a flathead but they don't seem to want to budge.

You may need to take the weight off the rear wheel to make it easier to do the adjustment. If you have a floor jack you can raise the bike up by the frame till the rear shock is fully extended just before the tire leaves the ground. It made it easier for me when I adjusted the preload on my X.

Are the axel brackets pressed on to the bottom of the fork tubes? I had a pretty good crash and the bike didn't track straight afterwards. I loosened the axel pinch clamps and the upper and lower pinch clamps on the triple trees but I don't see any way to loosen the bottom of the forks.

You should be able to fix that by simply loostening the pinch bolts on the fork uppers and then re-tightening them. If you have the front AXLE installed, the twist should come right out on its own once you loosten the pinch bolts...

OK I have been reading through masses of posts etc on here (HighFive) and ADV (Derangedhermit) and want to get some input and possibly pics/video from anyone that can help before jumping in as this is virgin territory for me!

There is heaps of great info out there - but there is always grey area taking someone’s written or spoken word and I find pics or video help immensely!

Anyway my understanding from various posts on forums so far
– and I am 6’2” and 220 (100kgs) for reference.

· All adjustments are made starting from maximum damping.


· Maximum damping is always found by turning the adjustment screw or knob in the clockwise direction (as you look at the head of the adjustment screw).


· All adjustments are measured in counterclockwise "clicks" from maximum damping.

Fork adjustments:

Always adjust the left and right front fork tubes evenly.

Fork rebound damping
is set at the top of each fork tube. As you look down at the adjusting screw, turn it gently but completely clockwise until it stops. This is maximum rebound damping ("Hard" suspension).

Maximum (hard) = 1 click out (counter clockwise)
Standard = 10 clicks out (counter clockwise)
Minimum (soft) = 12 clicks out (counter clockwise)

Fork compression damping is set at the bottom of each fork tube. Pry out the small black rubber plug at the very end of the tube. Turn clockwise to reach maximum compression damping. Replace plug when finished.

Maximum (hard) = 1 click out (counter clockwise)
Standard = 10 clicks out (counter clockwise)
Minimum (soft) = 19 clicks out (counter clockwise)

Rear shock adjustment:

The knurled knob at the bottom of the shock sets shock rebound damping, access is from
right side of bike. "Clockwise" on this is as if you were looking up
from underneath, just like the compression damping on the fork. That is, turn
the side of the knob closest to you towards the front of the bike to go
clockwise.

Turn clockwise to max damping.
Max = 1 click out (counter clockwise)
Std = 12 clicks out (counter clockwise) (WR250R)
Std = 13 clicks out (counter clockwise) (WR250X)
Min = 25 clicks out (counter clockwise)

Shock compression damping is accessed from the left side of bike. It is the small screw at the top of the external oil reservoir.

Turn clockwise to max damping.
Max = 1 click out (counter clockwise)
Std = 10 clicks out (counter clockwise) (WR250R)
Std = 7 clicks out (counter clockwise) (WR250X)
Min = 12 clicks out (counter clockwise)

Remember, "Max" always means maximum damping. That means hard suspension. Min means minimum damping. That means soft suspension.

Rider Sag (from HighFive for a 250lbsrider)
Measure the bike from the rear axle to a consistent point above (near helmet lock of frame). Then, sit on it in your riding gear and
measure again. This might take a helper. Adjust the preload spring on your rear shock so that your Sag is between 3" - 4".

Next, adjust the Rear Shock Rebound to the Maximum Setting (only 3 clicks out). Then, adjust the Rear Shock Compression to 4 clicks out.

Set the Fork Rebound (at top) to 10 - 12 clicks. And the Fork Compression (at bottom) to same 10 - 12 clicks. Just make certain you set both the left & right sides to equal "clicks".

I am fairly confident I have the shock and rebound adjustments clearly understood - and for someone my weight soft at the front and hard at the back is a good starting place? I am starting to do lots of jumps (small) and ride on hard rocky terrain.

One thing that is not clear is how to set the preload spring distance - measuring - no probs - but then exactly how do I set it? This is where a pic or two would be awesome!

Appreciate anyones input here !!
Thanks
Lance

Sorry about the extra spacing on the previous post!!!!

Found these pages and they help with the SAG understanding
http://motocross.transworld.net/features/tuesday-tip-setting-sag-on-a-ktm/
http://motocross.transworld.net/features/tuesday-tip-setting-your-sag/

My question remains the same though - as the rear shock on these pages are different from ours - how do I go about adjusting and what way do I adjust given the measurements I recieve?

Thanks again
Lance

Hello I have A 2015 wr250r with 800 miles on it first owner . I ride as much dirt as possible and as little road as possible I haven't played with the shock settings yet and was wondering when I'm riding off road what do I base my shock settings on. Bottoming out? Front tire kicking out in turns? Soft sand?hard whoops? I just would like to know more about why I would adjust the shock settings for the future. I'm 155 pounds I ride the bike pretty hard I used to own. Yz85 when I wAs younger at the track and I'm not tooting my own horn but I can ride hard so I don't want the stock shock settings to be affecting me badly without knowing

what would be settings for 200lbs? tx!