World's Biggest Mountain Bike

Rode the Cannel trail today (well, part of it, got stopped by deep snow about 11 mile up), and on the way down I like to ride in Neutral, engine off...


https://youtu.be/ckUwWgUkcjk

Beautiful trail.

I thought you weren't supposed to spin that back tire for extended periods without the engine on?

That's what I read too, but I don't believe it. I'm not sure how rolling around in Neutral can be bad for anything. I mean, if you're in gear, holding the clutch in maybe, and if you do it for an hour at 60 mph maybe, but I'm just not sure how anything can get damaged that way.

I mean, maybe someone else can tell me, when the bike is in neutral, and you move forward, what parts inside the engine actually spin? Are those parts not covered in oil anyways, or does oil only get squirted on those moving parts when the engine is on?

Anyways, I've done it for so many years on so many bikes and nothing has ever worn out or broken so maybe I just got lucky...

Same as your car. When it is in neutral the pistons are a-turning. Question is whether the oil pump is pumping on the bike I guess as it is driven by the gears. I cannot see how a short run like that could hurt too much.

No way the piston is moving up and down while rolling in neutral. Sorry, but no way no how. Not with the engine off like I have.

Leaving the engine idling will surely pump whatever needs pumped, but I'm pretty sure that any moving part in the case is rotating in oil the whole time, even when the engine is off...

I am guessing the gears, drive axle (jack shaft) etc are turning as they are connected directly to the rear tire via the chain. I am by no means an authority, but it is reasonable to be concerned about proper lubrication of these components when the engine isnt running. Just my two cents worth.

I would think all these parts are sitting in the oil, no? And the gears would be disengaged while in neutral, no?

only the gears low enough are sitting in oil. even still i dought that a short run in neutral with the engine off would hurt anything, the oil still builds a film on everything and it takes awile for it to all settle back on the bottom. I think they put that in their so you dont tow it behind your car or something with one of those little transporters that hold the front wheel and let the back tire run on the road.

Dan893 wrote:

only the gears low enough are sitting in oil. even still i dought that a short run in neutral with the engine off would hurt anything, the oil still builds a film on everything and it takes awile for it to all settle back on the bottom. I think they put that in their so you dont tow it behind your car or something with one of those little transporters that hold the front wheel and let the back tire run on the road.

Pretty much it.

These days, one of the tricks engine designers use to get more power out of the engine than in days gone by is to get the spinning parts up above the oil and reduce drag.

There are still some spinning parts down low in the oil, but the big ones like the crankshaft and clutch and transmission shafts/gears are up high.
There is splash lubrication going on, but the oil pump has to pump it up under pressure to these parts in the first place, and once the oil gets to the end of it's oil delivery path, it leaks out past the connecting rod and crank pin, camshaft, transmission shaft and transmission gear and gets flung off.
So, the parts are not only lubricated, but cooled by this.

Some engines don't use a radial ball or needle bearing on one end of a transmission shaft, but a bushing that relies on oil film.
All of the transmission gears that are able to freely rotate on their shafts are bushed in a similar way, and even while in neutral, there are always gears engaged and spinning on stopped shafts.
This is the "constant mesh transmission" you read about in specs.

You can get away with relying on the oil film between the transmission parts while doing this unless you go to extremes like towing behind a car for miles.

Myself, I always ride under power because I like using the throttle while maneuvering the bike.

That's what I figured, that as long as I'm only doing it a low speeds (10-15mph) and for a few miles at a time (I still have to start the bike at least every few miles for an uphill) it should be ok. Towing it down the freeway was never an option for me.

I like the quiet. Wish they made a Yamaha WRR that was electric and had a range of 300 miles and could be charged in 5 minutes. How I would love to have that 100% torque at 0 rpm and be able to crawl the bike up things at 1mph if I need to without roasting the clutch...

Someday...

This comes close, but not quite,

http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/zero-fx/

GusinCA wrote:

That's what I figured, that as long as I'm only doing it a low speeds (10-15mph) and for a few miles at a time (I still have to start the bike at least every few miles for an uphill) it should be ok. Towing it down the freeway was never an option for me.

I like the quiet. Wish they made a Yamaha WRR that was electric and had a range of 300 miles and could be charged in 5 minutes. How I would love to have that 100% torque at 0 rpm and be able to crawl the bike up things at 1mph if I need to without roasting the clutch...

Someday...

This comes close, but not quite,

http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/zero-fx/

75 ft lbs of torque and 44hp is pretty sick. Only down side is the range however you can buy the fast charger and go from dead to 100% in an hour and a half.

My rides never go past about 40 miles, so it might work for me. I wonder how to protect that area behind the front wheel against rocks, my bashplate has some really deep gouges in it already...

12 thousand dollars is not cheap, though. But riding silent would be a huge plus for me....

GusinCA wrote:

My rides never go past about 40 miles, so it might work for me. I wonder how to protect that area behind the front wheel against rocks, my bashplate has some really deep gouges in it already...

12 thousand dollars is not cheap, though. But riding silent would be a huge plus for me....

Depending on where you live theirs a tax credit for 10% of the price of the electric vehicle up to $2500. I've really been debating getting the fx. The part behind the front wheel looks like the heatsink for the motor speed controller would need to be careful not to smash it.

I just got off the phone with the dealer, that is the heat sink for the controller. He said it only gets hot at high speeds, and then there is more air to cool it. He's seen people put bashplates over it.

I would need to wire an inverter into my truck's electrical system to charge it (650 watts required) and it takes 8 hours to charge the dual battery version from completely dead to fully charged. The only big disadvantage I see is if you wanted to ride one day, then camp for the night, and ride again the next day (not being able to run your engine all night to charge it). The only solution then is to buy two extra battery packs (you can swap them out quickly), but those are $$$$$.

I think I'll just stick to my ultra reliable, easy to refuel, 200+ mile range WR250R, the most perfect motorcycle ever built... :)

GusinCA wrote:

I just got off the phone with the dealer, that is the heat sink for the controller. He said it only gets hot at high speeds, and then there is more air to cool it. He's seen people put bashplates over it.

I would need to wire an inverter into my truck's electrical system to charge it (650 watts required) and it takes 8 hours to charge the dual battery version from completely dead to fully charged. The only big disadvantage I see is if you wanted to ride one day, then camp for the night, and ride again the next day (not being able to run your engine all night to charge it). The only solution then is to buy two extra battery packs (you can swap them out quickly), but those are $$$$$.

I think I'll just stick to my ultra reliable, easy to refuel, 200+ mile range WR250R, the most perfect motorcycle ever built... :)

Yeah that's the main thing keeping me from going electric. I love my wr250r she does everything I need. One day the electric technology will be even better and make going that route no problem.

I mean, the power on that thing is incredible. The dealer said it does 0-60 in 3.9 seconds...