WRR vs KTM 500 EXC: dual sport shootout

KTM's are race built machines? I didn't realize that they were all race machines. I thought the street legal ones were not.

My bad.

The EXC's are purebred enduro bikes with blinkers and a horn.

Wallrat wrote:

When I got my KTM I specifically sought out a 2007 because I wanted the factory legal RFS engine and that's the only year it was made.  .

^^^ This. The RFS motor is rock solid. I have a street legal 450EXC that just keeps going even when it shouldnt be.

Rusty Shovel wrote:

marleymouse wrote:

...bit like comparing a suzuki jeep to a range rover! 

There's only one Jeep--and it will crush the range rover at everything besides picking up debutantes at vodka bars.  

But I take your point.  The closest match KTM has to the WR250R is the 690 EnduroR

KTM Enduro 690R: Relaxed (by KTM standards) service intervals, almost the same weight, 3x the power, excellent suspension, much more money.

I'll be honest; the 690 tempts me.  I weigh 220.  Once I get loaded down for adventure my bike struggles at freeway speeds.  The WR250R is a great little bike, but I find my eye wandering.  If Yamaha doesn't have any plans to build the Blue Unicorn (WR450R) by the time KTM's 390 Enduro R is released, my brand loyalty might reach the breaking point.

Best part of a jeep is the mercedes engine in it...range rover would spank a jeep everywhere.. 

I'm sorry, but I see stock Jeep Rubicons in places a Range Rover could never, ever go.

My friend, who's a Green Beret with two tours has told me that overseas, the Land Rover Defenders that foreign military forces use often were constantly breaking down to the point that many of their SF troops simply hitched rides in Hummers.

Nope, again, given a rocky trail full of branches sticking out to scratch and in the middle of nowhere, I'll take a Rubicon with a winch over a fancy Range Rover every day. And then I'll put the top down and really enjoy the outdoors. And when I get back I'll admire the scratches along the sides, and not fret about how each one would cost me 4 figures at the local RR shop... :)

But then I'd get in my RR and take my wife on a date... :)

Quote :

Best part of a jeep is the mercedes engine in it...range rover would spank a jeep everywhere.. 

Okay, just did a little research on your Mercedes engine claim and it doesn't hold up.  Chrysler developed the engine.

And where exactly does the Range Rover spank a Jeep Rubicon? I've yet to see it.

The truth is, the RR has become the automotive equivalent of the GS1200.  Fast, heavy, expensive...and largely useless off-road. Sure, the RR has some clever all-wheel drive features, but those features are geared toward getting Victoria Beckham to the shops or perhaps navigating the slippery lawns at Downton Abby.  To Range Rover's credit, it DOES have a smooth ride, beautiful wood paneling, and a crisp stereo.

The Jeep Rubicon is a purpose-built off road rig.  You'll have to unzip the driver's pants to find wood.

Rusty Shovel wrote:

Quote :

Best part of a jeep is the mercedes engine in it...range rover would spank a jeep everywhere.. 

Okay, just did a little research on your Mercedes engine claim and it doesn't hold up.  Chrysler developed the engine.

And where exactly does the Range Rover spank a Jeep Rubicon? I've yet to see it.

The truth is, the RR has become the automotive equivalent of the GS1200.  Fast, heavy, expensive...and largely useless off-road. Sure, the RR has some clever all-wheel drive features, but those features are geared toward getting Victoria Beckham to the shops or perhaps navigating the slippery lawns at Downton Abby.  To Range Rover's credit, it DOES have a smooth ride, beautiful wood paneling, and a crisp stereo.

The Jeep Rubicon is a purpose-built off road rig.  You'll have to unzip the driver's pants to find wood.

A range rover feels finished & well built has a great chassis & suberb plush ride & because it has a sophisticated adjustable suspension system can do it all....a jeep has the gutsy german engine but lacks refinement has crude dated suspension poor ground clearance wooly steering & a plastic tacky interior...if you want the best all rounder the RR rules...& people seem to be forming a queue to buy one

And 99.9% of those people in line would say "dirt, eww!"

What a waste of a great machine.

Oh, and just to update everyone here, the British couple that's trying to ride around the world whose woes on their new KTM 690 Adventure's I've described here earlier, well now HER bike is making loud clanking noises and they will need to tear the engine down to see if it's the rocker arm problem that grenaded his bake earlier in the trip. Now they're in Alaska and might have to scrap the trip for a while since all the bike repairs have cost them wayyy more than they thought it was going to.

Sorry, but I still maintain the KTM is expensive crap and BMW's are only slightly less crap but more expensive and that Yamaha makes the most reliable machines out there.

Sucks to be on a broken bike with no money... in a strange place.  That's cold and starting to get a lot colder.

The Jeep vs Land Rover discussion earlier was somewhat interesting.  My wife owns and drives a Jeep Liberty, but it's definitely a bird hunting rig, not an offroad, combat, Rubicon type rig.  It's okay, but I might like it better if she'd been able to get the Diesel version that was here all too briefly.

However, taking away urban SUV use, I'll second observations that the Land Rover is a POS for hard core use like the military.  My younger brother has some first hand experience with that, being a contract mechanic to the Brit military at BATUS.  He has said more than once that it is easier to tear armour off and repair a Chally MBT or a Warrior than working on a (many expletives deleted) Land Rover.  When I'm visiting him or we're working with the Brits, I don't hear many of their troopies talking about the Land Rover with affection either.

On the other hand, back about 1983 when some of you were just puppies, we ran Jeep CJs with a mounting point on the back for the 106mm recoilless rifle.  We pushed them out of the airplanes before we jumped... despite the best the packer/riggers could do, they hit the ground pretty hard and it wasn't uncommon to find them laying on their sides after turning over on landing and/or being dragged by the parachute.  If I could find some of my old slides and digitize them, I'd post them up.  I don't remember us ever leaving a CJ on the DZ because it was broke from the landing, wouldn't start, etc.  Those weren't the old 50's Jeeps, but the later variants that were essentially a military version of the CJ sold to the public with military paint, wiring, etc.  And when we dropped the 106mm recoilless in favour of the much lighter and longer range TOW, the CJs continued to soldier on.  I can't remember when they finally took them out of service and sold them as surpus, probably around 1990 or so.

Anyways, those CJs were indestructible.  AND, they also went just about anywhere you pointed them at, even top heavy with that 500 lb recoilless rifle sticking out over top and a combat load of 106mm HEAT rounds on board.  Surprisingly hard to tip over even then.  Best of all, they always started, always, and never suddenly and mysteriously broke down and died.  On a recreational vehicle, those kinds of problems are called "inconvenient".  In the military, where the intent was to snipe at Russian armour on a shoot and scoot basis, that's called "You're dead".  Fortunately, we never had to test it out, but we really trusted those CJs, and they never gave us any reason to doubt them.

I'd also take a CJ over a Hummer any day of the week, except for comfort, but that's another story.

GusinCA wrote:

KTM is expensive crap and BMW's are only slightly less crap but more expensive and that Yamaha makes the most reliable machines out there.

I have to agree on this! BMW cars are about like their bikes. I've had to work on BMWs and simple maintenance services are more complex & expensive than on a domestic or Japanese car. If you have any major repair needed, you better get your whole family's wallet out!

hmm, what about this???

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhWR5jjGzfM

not to be misunderstood. I love my WR/R

greets
Bubbler

Ummm, yeah, that doesn't look sponsored by KTM or anything, what with the banners, the ready to race logos, the aerial helicopter shots (no film crew? then who is flying the helicopter when both of these guys are in the shot?). This is an AMAZING video, but it is heavily funded by the boys from KTM in Austria...

And if it were a WRR, it would read "70,000 km and not a single mechanical failure"... :)